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1

Friday, April 7th 2006, 12:19am

Second naval program of PRJ

Second joint program for the PRJ countrys call's for a relativly smaller ship armed better that a treaty cruiser but with the same displacment.

Its protection is to be protected from from weapons up to 210mm(8,1in) in calibre its speed is to be over 28kt.
Armed in minimum of six guns of calliber over 254mm(10in)
And bourd side of minimum six 150mm(6in)secondary guns
Lengh 170m max(type 3 drydock)

Basicly a pancerschiff.

Polska, Poland Armoured cruiser laid down 1932

Displacement:
14 064 t light; 14 821 t standard; 15 386 t normal; 15 838 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
564,07 ft / 557,74 ft x 82,02 ft x 22,64 ft (normal load)
171,93 m / 170,00 m x 25,00 m x 6,90 m

Armament:
6 - 11,02" / 280 mm guns (2x3 guns), 669,80lbs / 303,81kg shells, 1932 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, evenly spread
6 - 5,91" / 150 mm guns (2x3 guns), 102,98lbs / 46,71kg shells, 1932 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on side, all amidships, all raised mounts - superfiring
12 - 4,33" / 110 mm guns (6x2 guns), 40,61lbs / 18,42kg shells, 1932 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread
16 - 1,57" / 40,0 mm guns (4x4 guns), 1,95lbs / 0,89kg shells, 1932 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
Weight of broadside 5 155 lbs / 2 338 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 150
6 - 23,6" / 600 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 6,89" / 175 mm 362,83 ft / 110,59 m 10,86 ft / 3,31 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Main Belt covers 100% of normal length
Main belt does not fully cover magazines and engineering spaces

- Torpedo Bulkhead:
2,36" / 60 mm 362,53 ft / 110,50 m 20,31 ft / 6,19 m

- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 10,0" / 254 mm 3,94" / 100 mm 10,0" / 254 mm
2nd: 3,15" / 80 mm 1,57" / 40 mm 3,15" / 80 mm
3rd: 0,79" / 20 mm 0,39" / 10 mm -

- Armour deck: 3,15" / 80 mm, Conning tower: 10,00" / 254 mm

Machinery:
Diesel Internal combustion motors,
Geared drive, 2 shafts, 68 068 shp / 50 779 Kw = 29,00 kts
Range 8 000nm at 10,00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 1 016 tons

Complement:
689 - 897

Cost:
£5,976 million / $23,906 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 644 tons, 4,2%
Armour: 4 808 tons, 31,2%
- Belts: 1 173 tons, 7,6%
- Torpedo bulkhead: 643 tons, 4,2%
- Armament: 976 tons, 6,3%
- Armour Deck: 1 882 tons, 12,2%
- Conning Tower: 133 tons, 0,9%
Machinery: 2 009 tons, 13,1%
Hull, fittings & equipment: 6 553 tons, 42,6%
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1 322 tons, 8,6%
Miscellaneous weights: 50 tons, 0,3%

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
24 218 lbs / 10 985 Kg = 36,2 x 11,0 " / 280 mm shells or 4,3 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,19
Metacentric height 5,1 ft / 1,6 m
Roll period: 15,2 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 51 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,40
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,02

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has raised forecastle
and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0,520
Length to Beam Ratio: 6,80 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 27,78 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 58 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 11,00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 32,55 ft / 9,92 m
- Forecastle (20%): 22,44 ft / 6,84 m (19,82 ft / 6,04 m aft of break)
- Mid (50%): 19,82 ft / 6,04 m
- Quarterdeck (15%): 19,82 ft / 6,04 m
- Stern: 19,82 ft / 6,04 m
- Average freeboard: 21,15 ft / 6,45 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 100,2%
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 156,7%
Waterplane Area: 32 299 Square feet or 3 001 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 110%
Structure weight / hull surface area: 145 lbs/sq ft or 709 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0,94
- Longitudinal: 1,83
- Overall: 1,00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent

Well Im not totaly happy with this ship but its still a potent design

2

Friday, April 7th 2006, 8:20am

With her beam she's going to have problems shoehorning those triple 6" turrets on the waist possitions, at least at first glance.

Did you try a 4x2 layout?

HoOmAn

Keeper of the Sacred Block Coefficient

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3

Friday, April 7th 2006, 9:15am

A transome stern on a ship with her l:b ratio and speed? Does this make sense?

4

Friday, April 7th 2006, 11:57am

Quoted

Main belt does not fully cover magazines and engineering spaces


This would concern me.....

Also, I'm not sure there's a lot of point in having only 3 150mms per side, especially not on a ship that's primarily intended to fight other ships (as opposed to sinking merchantmen).

5

Friday, April 7th 2006, 4:11pm

Actually I think the 130mm guns are superfiring over the main armament.

Apart from the armor belt, she looks like a good ship. Very similar to the planned Mexican Pocket battleship.

6

Friday, April 7th 2006, 4:22pm

Quoted

Actually I think the 130mm guns are superfiring over the main armament.


That could be the intent, but right now in the design they're not.

Quoted

6 - 5,91" / 150 mm guns (2x3 guns), 102,98lbs / 46,71kg shells, 1932 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on side, all amidships, all raised mounts - superfiring

7

Friday, April 7th 2006, 8:43pm

I know that mines and torpedos are a concern in the Baltic, but I think you'd be well served to ditch the torpedo bulkheads and invest in a narrower hull with more speed. Otherwise, there are going to be plenty of Nordmarchian, German, and Danish capital ships nearby with sufficient speed to catch and kill this ship - which in turn will struggle to catch the heavy and light cruisers it ought to be preying on.

8

Friday, April 7th 2006, 9:00pm

I agree, it fact I'd go a step further and reduce some of her armor in order to get a 32 knot ship. I'd also rather see four twin 5.9" turrets if the entent is to mount them on the beams, but I'm guessing they were meant to be superfiring.

9

Saturday, April 8th 2006, 1:18am

Mmmmmmm....

Targets for my land-based Torpedo Bombers!

Although with 12 110mm and 16 40mm, she's got a decent AAA suite, not to mention good underwater protection for her size.

What's her mission though? Her speed's unnecessarily high for just lurking near the Polish coast, and she's not armored quite well enough to withstand serious coast artillery, of which there's no shortage in the Baltic.

So it's into the central Baltic.

But what's there that anyone wants?

10

Saturday, April 8th 2006, 11:59am

What does it matter that the belt doesn't cover the vitals. It is only 6.9" thick. Sinking this ship would have the prestige of sinking a 'battleship' as it has 11" guns.

Mission = flagpole.

10 1482 tons destroyers would be a better investment. At least you could have some of these in the Black Sea, Adriatic Sea and the Baltic at the same time.

Cheers,

11

Saturday, April 8th 2006, 5:47pm

That was a stupid thing on my part not to change the secondarys placment.

Polska, Poland Armoured cruiser laid down 1932

Displacement:
14 064 t light; 14 821 t standard; 15 386 t normal; 15 838 t full load

Dimensions: Length overall / water x beam x draught
564,07 ft / 557,74 ft x 82,02 ft x 22,64 ft (normal load)
171,93 m / 170,00 m x 25,00 m x 6,90 m

Armament:
6 - 11,02" / 280 mm guns (2x3 guns), 669,80lbs / 303,82kg shells, 1932 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, evenly spread
6 - 5,91" / 150 mm guns (2x3 guns), 102,98lbs / 46,71kg shells, 1932 Model
Breech loading guns in turrets (on barbettes)
on centreline ends, evenly spread, all raised mounts
12 - 4,33" / 110 mm guns (6x2 guns), 40,61lbs / 18,42kg shells, 1932 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread
16 - 1,57" / 40,0 mm guns (4x4 guns), 1,95lbs / 0,88kg shells, 1932 Model
Breech loading guns in deck mounts
on side, evenly spread, all raised mounts
Weight of broadside 5 155 lbs / 2 338 kg
Shells per gun, main battery: 150
6 - 23,6" / 600 mm above water torpedoes

Armour:
- Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg)
Main: 6,89" / 175 mm 363,48 ft / 110,79 m 10,86 ft / 3,31 m
Ends: Unarmoured
Main Belt covers 100% of normal length

- Torpedo Bulkhead:
2,36" / 60 mm 362,53 ft / 110,50 m 20,31 ft / 6,19 m

- Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max)
Main: 10,0" / 254 mm 3,94" / 100 mm 10,0" / 254 mm
2nd: 3,15" / 80 mm 1,57" / 40 mm 3,15" / 80 mm
3rd: 0,79" / 20 mm 0,39" / 10 mm -

- Armour deck: 3,15" / 80 mm, Conning tower: 10,00" / 254 mm

Machinery:
Diesel Internal combustion motors,
Geared drive, 2 shafts, 68 068 shp / 50 779 Kw = 29,00 kts
Range 8 000nm at 10,00 kts
Bunker at max displacement = 1 016 tons

Complement:
689 - 897

Cost:
£5,976 million / $23,906 million

Distribution of weights at normal displacement:
Armament: 644 tons, 4,2%
Armour: 4 809 tons, 31,3%
- Belts: 1 175 tons, 7,6%
- Torpedo bulkhead: 643 tons, 4,2%
- Armament: 976 tons, 6,3%
- Armour Deck: 1 882 tons, 12,2%
- Conning Tower: 133 tons, 0,9%
Machinery: 2 009 tons, 13,1%
Hull, fittings & equipment: 6 552 tons, 42,6%
Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1 322 tons, 8,6%
Miscellaneous weights: 50 tons, 0,3%

Overall survivability and seakeeping ability:
Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship):
24 218 lbs / 10 985 Kg = 36,2 x 11,0 " / 280 mm shells or 4,3 torpedoes
Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,19
Metacentric height 5,1 ft / 1,6 m
Roll period: 15,2 seconds
Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 51 %
- Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,40
Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,02

Hull form characteristics:
Hull has raised forecastle
and transom stern
Block coefficient: 0,520
Length to Beam Ratio: 6,80 : 1
'Natural speed' for length: 27,78 kts
Power going to wave formation at top speed: 58 %
Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50
Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 11,00 degrees
Stern overhang: 0,00 ft / 0,00 m
Freeboard (% = measuring location as a percentage of overall length):
- Stem: 32,55 ft / 9,92 m
- Forecastle (20%): 22,44 ft / 6,84 m (19,82 ft / 6,04 m aft of break)
- Mid (50%): 19,82 ft / 6,04 m
- Quarterdeck (15%): 19,82 ft / 6,04 m
- Stern: 19,82 ft / 6,04 m
- Average freeboard: 21,15 ft / 6,45 m

Ship space, strength and comments:
Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 100,2%
- Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 156,7%
Waterplane Area: 32 299 Square feet or 3 001 Square metres
Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 110%
Structure weight / hull surface area: 145 lbs/sq ft or 708 Kg/sq metre
Hull strength (Relative):
- Cross-sectional: 0,94
- Longitudinal: 1,83
- Overall: 1,00
Hull space for machinery, storage, compartmentation is adequate
Room for accommodation and workspaces is excellent


This is my idea of a heavy cruiser and a planed BB's smaler brothers
Actualy this ships are to operate in black sea and adriatic baltic is not there main teater of operation althou they will be stationed there. those will be the largest ships in the Yugoslavian navy as Yugoslavia isnt planing on bilding any BB.
This ship has nice small turning radius and is able to dodge a torpedo.It turning rate is better for evading torpedos that speed.


@Alt naval

Quoted

mission=flagpole


Not realy well not for romania and poland atleast
BB's have the mission :)

@AdmKuznetsow
Wellwe all know that every ship bigger that CL is a torpedo bomber magnet but this realisation hadnt hit the PRJ naval planers yeat