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Thursday, October 26th 2006, 7:58pm

Self Propelled Guns

Would it be possible to stuff an open mounted 105mm gun on the Atlantean AT-27 Mk I chassis? Mexico has 7 spare 105mm barrels lying around so I'm wondering if that would be possible.


Thursday, October 26th 2006, 8:16pm

Assuming your 105mm gun is 20-30 calibres or so, you'll need 15-20tons probably in a limited train mountain. Do you want Self-propelled artillery or a tank destroyer?


Thursday, October 26th 2006, 8:20pm

Self propelled artillery. No need to train the guns.


Thursday, October 26th 2006, 8:24pm

In that case yes it is possible. You'll have to stiffen the suspension because of the extra weight. This'll limit the speed and mobility further.


Thursday, October 26th 2006, 8:29pm

How about 75mm guns? Is a Tank Destroyer possible with those using the same chassis?


Friday, October 27th 2006, 11:34am

Semovente 75/18 weighing 15tons. You can probably get this down to 13/14tons by shaving off some armour. You don't actually need a 75mm gun to penetrate the armour thats around currently.


Friday, October 27th 2006, 11:55am

Very true (the part about not needing a 75mm at this time). There are, actually, relatively few 75mm guns available at this time that are even very useful against armor. Most of the guns in that size range are relatively light weight guns for firing HE or shrapnel rounds (like the famous French 75mm), neither of which are very useful against armor that can't be penetrated by a 37mm AT gun.


Friday, October 27th 2006, 3:08pm

I used the Tank Destroyer definition but Mexico doesnt really have an enemy with Tanks. So its more of a Self Propelled Gun with trainable gun instead of the fixed larger gun.


Friday, October 27th 2006, 10:54pm

Its ironic that you mention the AT-27, Atlantis is currently working on several different AT platforms, one of which is the AT-27 with a 45mm gun, a 75mm gun was also seriously considered but given the info presented here that would likely develope into a SP arty platform, turretless of course.

The Rhino halftrack and a standard 5 ton truck will also test mount a 37mm or 45mm weapon, with the Rhino likely being the more practical design.

Gavin, have you found any program that designs tanks specifically and if so what program do you need to run it?


Saturday, October 28th 2006, 12:48am

Theres an excel spreadsheet called tinker tank by Greg Locock. pm me your email address again and I'll send you a copy. Its not very accurate though as it uses iterative methods and doesn't really include enough data. Best to use almost historical designs or ones others have done - i recently found someone who'd designed an Italian 75mm gunned beast. his rough sketch of it here;


Saturday, October 28th 2006, 12:51am

Nordmarks latest tank designs and SPG designs each mount a 2.3inch gun.


Saturday, October 28th 2006, 2:10am

Why? 57mm or 6pdr is massive overkill for shooting at tanks, and the HE shell is too small against infantry. You'd want a nice light tank that doesn't fall through lakes in winter or sink in bog during summer.


Saturday, October 28th 2006, 5:25am

Tell that to the Russians, historically the T-28 was armed with a 76.2mm gun and 3 MG, in 1933 no less.
Then theres the follow-on T-35 with a 76.3mm gun, 2x45mm guns and 6x7.62mg's. The T-35 was later modified to act as armored trains by removing the road gear and crudely mounting them on flat cars.


Saturday, October 28th 2006, 5:39am

Could be worse. It could be this:

I have no idea what this is, but it looks like a tank with two 11" German cannons from a triple turret were the middle gun was extras.


Saturday, October 28th 2006, 5:48am

Looks similar to this...

...without the naval range finder and extra guns though.

Looks like a funky kitbash job to me. Hell I had a 1:650 scale (IIRC) model of the Bizmarck. The turrets with barbettes fit nicely into a 1:24 scale car tire, for a nice Mad Max effect.


Saturday, October 28th 2006, 11:15am


Tell that to the Russians, historically the T-28 was armed with a 76.2mm gun and 3 MG, in 1933 no less.

Thats a low-velocity HE gun for against infantry mainly.


Saturday, October 28th 2006, 11:37am

Quite. You have to be careful, especially during the period before about 1941, when you're looking at the size of a tank cannon to also look at the length of the bore. The T-28, like the T-35, had a 76.2mm gun, but it was a howitzer for firing HE shells. The T-28 would use it against other tanks as well because the tanks of the day were pretty lightly armored, but the primary anti-tank armament of the T-35 was actually the 45mm guns, not the 76.2mm gun in the central turret.